The regular meeting of the Planning Board, Town of Moreau, County of Saratoga and State of New York was held in the Town Office Building, 61 Hudson Street, South Glens Falls, New York on September 18, 2006.

Planning Board members in attendance were Chairman Peter Jensen, Ronald Zimmerman Thomas Field, Kenneth Dixon, Gary Dickinson and Ronald Caulin.

The meeting was called to order by Chairman Jensen at 7:00 p.m

       1.    Resource Systems Group

Mr. Ceali of Resource Systems Group presented the Access Management Study to develop a guidebook to Access Management for the Greater Glens Falls area.

Four corridors around Glens Falls are being examined, including Route 9 and Quaker Road in Queensbury and Route 197 South of Glens Falls in Moreau. This is a good case study because it is a rural area. Route 197 is an important truck and thru traffic route, but there is development on it as well. He presented some strategies to control traffic issues in that area in the future.

Aaron Frankenfelt was also in attendance representing Glens Falls Transit Authority which ordered the study. They are reaching out to all the communities for feedback. They would like to comeback with specific recommendations for this corridor.

Mr. Zimmerman : What is your source for the data on crashes?

Mr. Ceali: the data comes from NYSDOT, which gets it from the municipalities and police departments.

Mr. Field: Most of the lots available there is R-5 district and will get a lot of scrutiny for residential uses. With increased traffic, the problems are in the Route 9 to Gansevoort Road area, which is completely developed in small lots almost entirely residential. Looking at circle drives in that area, I like them because you reduce the number of vehicles backing out into traffic. The board recommends against them. One problem we anticipate is that the area appeals for commercial uses, but they are small lots, which presents a challenge.

Mr. Ceali: The County will give us a theoretical maximum of how much development is reasonable, from their studies, and we can develop traffic concerns with that.

Mr. Frankenfelt: This is just an example, our recommendations won’t be limited to this corridor?

Chairman Jensen: When will your recommendations be completed?

Mr. Ceali: About January.

Chairman Jensen: It would be great to have this information available for the master plan committee.

Mr. Ceali: We do have a report that you can begin to use right away.

Ted Been: Unless something has changed, I do not believe there is any support for changes in the zoning on Route 197. We tried to recommend it when I was on the comprehensive plan committee, and there was resistance in the public hearings.

Chairman Jensen: Lets encourage others to attend the public hearings. Any other questions?

        2.    The Preserve at Old Saratoga

Chairman Jensen: This is the public hearing for The Preserve at Old Saratoga. Briefly describe the project so that members of the community who want to comment on it will know what they are commenting about.

Gordon Nicholson with Environmental Design presented the project for the public.

Mr. Nicholson: The plans include subdivision plans, common drive plans, grading and environmental and traffic studies. We worked with The Department of Fish and Wildlife, Carner Blue butterfly flight times were studied and nothing was seen. No wetlands, no environmental concerns. There were culturally significant sites identified which will not be disturbed – they will be fenced off during construction. The soil has been tested and the sand is acceptable for septic systems. We consulted Rosick Well Drillers and the aquifer is 50-60 feet below ground and 26 new wells are not expected to have an impact on the water supply.

Niagara Mohawk has a power line with an easement through the property and they recommended a pole to raise the sagging lines, no problems are expected. Three homeowner’s associations will own and maintain the common driveways and other areas. The storm water management area is proposed to be 100% recharge. Traffic studies and sight distances have been explored and meet the standards. Environmental Studies and peripheral studies have been submitted.

Chairman Jensen: The Planning Board will listen as the public questions to project and submit comments. Please identify yourself so that we can maintain accurate records. Any comments or questions?

Mr. Robert Deuval: As a property owner adjacent to the lower half, speaking for my grandmother, Janet Fortune. I have spoken to Mr. Garcia. My property is surveyed with granite posts on my pins. I don’t see any pins on the hairpin curves, and I do see posted signs and ribbons on my property. I want a survey and not the use of my pins for his survey points. I have a deed and I know where mine are. I want a buffer.

Mr. Nicholson: You are disputing the location? The ribbons in trees demarcating the general area where a study was done.

Mr. Deuval: I know where mine are. Where are his?

Mr. Patricke: He’s required to have them when he sells the lot. He’s not required to until then, but every point on that map has to be identified.

Jerry Magoolaghan: Ribbons generally indicate a boundary- they tell the people where they were when they did a study for water or butterflies. There are thousands of ribbons on the property and they have nothing to do with the survey.

Mr. Nicholson: Deeds were used with surveys when the original lines were set. Your pins were used to develop it and there are no disputes. The pins will be set when we get to work.

Mr. Deuval: There is one pin that I could not find on the 38.5 acres.

Mr. Nicholson: We haven’t started and there is no issue.

Mr. Deuval: I have an issue, I want to see his pin.

Chairman Jensen: I do believe that’s what Mr. Patricke indicated.

Mr. Deuval: I want to make sure it’s done properly. My other concern is, how can a person come before the planning board before they even know for certain that they own a certain piece?

Chairman Jensen: They have a deed. The details will be secured when the begin to work.

Jan Kropp: Will the electricity be buried, or the other power coming over?

Mr. Nicholson: The power line runs across the front of the lot, and we are doing nothing but adding pole.

Jan Kropp: No added wires?

Mr. Nicholson: No.

Mrs. Kropp: Julie Francis was asking whether there are setback guidelines for the distance from her property.

Shawn Geary, Ashford Estates and Barrington Drive: All of the houses are being built right on top of us with vacant land left on the other side of the parcel. This is so close it’s like Clifton Park, and this is Moreau and we like our space. There are deer in our back yards and endangered eastern hog nose snakes in our yards.

Mr. Nicholson: The subdivision layout complies with the town density and land use regulations, including the front side and rear etc. setbacks, then there are a pond, and steep slopes to preserve. That is why the construction is limited to one section of the property.

Mr. Geary: We are losing our back yards so you can preserve slopes.

Mr. Mauricio Francis: You are planning to build houses with new neighbors right on our property line?

Mr. Nicholson: No, not right on your property lines

Mr. Francis: Buffer?

Mr. Nicholson: The rear buffer is 30 feet, but most of the houses are 40 feet from the line. 20 feet is required, and the houses are shown 100 feet from the property line in that location.

Mr. Francis: Does the regulation require you to put a buffer?

Mr. Patricke: There are no buffer requirements.

Mr. Francis: So the house can be adjacent to the property line? I will have new neighbors, will you put up fencing or something to show people what the limit of their property is?

Mr. Nicholson: Our intention is not to disturb the existing vegetation. But the homeowners will have plot plans that show them where their property is and it is up to them to clear their back yards. Fencing it is up to the buyer.

Mr. Francis: People might have children or pets that trespass, and there is pond danger for lost children I hope your plans consider safety.

Mr. Field: Anyone who owns land in the vicinity can put whatever buffer they want up for themselves.

Mr. Deuval: Back to the power line. It also goes through my property. If this goes through it had better be buried because you are making an eyesore. My property has a buried power line and NIMO has an easement. We don’t want to look at that anymore and it ought to be buried. Also we’re all on wells, when all of a sudden we don’t have water anymore, who’s going to take are of that? I was born and raised there, and water will run out eventually. There’s a bunch of houses going in on Tom Cronin’s property, DA Collins’ etc.

Mr. Nicholson: Based on the underlying aquifer, there will be no problem.

Mr. Deuval: When you are not considering the other developments.

Mr. Nicholson: The study did show those and it said it would yield 4 million gallons a day.

Mrs. Tina Kays: How much is 4 million gallons a day?

Mr. Nicholson: A single family home uses 72,000 gallons a year.

Mrs. Kays: I heard that DA Collins didn’t have enough water on the property. And what studies has the town done on traffic because there are lot of curves, we love our country roads, and the town has been doing some work. And how is this affected by the road being closed for the Moreau State Park access?

Mr. Patricke: The town doesn’t do traffic studies.

Mrs. Kays: Have these people done it for Old Saratoga Road?

Mr. Nicholson: We provided a traffic study May 2006. There is a minimal impact of 23 cars at peak hours. This is good access management because there is one driveway coming out onto old Saratoga Road, which minimizes the number of curve cuts out onto an existing highway. One major access intersection is promoted. Saratoga County prefers this method over individual driveways as well. Most municipalities are looking at this.

Mrs. Kays: Please explain where the access will be

Mr. Nicholson: This one is 40 feet to the east from Catillays property. The center line is 80 feet from the property. This other access is a shared driveway for 2 houses, 400 feet east of the existing Garcia homes. That driveway is right on the property line.

Mrs. Kays: Can we go back to the water question? If each project does a separate water study, whose responsibility is it to assess what happens when all of these projects are up? Who’s the reviewing authority for that?

Chairman Jensen: That would be the Dept of Health.

Mrs. Kays: Independently or the impact of all three?

Chairman Jensen: Yes, they give all the developers a hard time.

Mrs. Dorothy Lechmanski: Can you explain the environmental assessment as far as the carner blue butterflies? I do see them on my property.

Mr. Nicholson: There are two flight periods in May and August, and during those active times we sent a scientist out and watched four blue lupine plants, which is historically what they like, in the center of the property. These four plants did not support enough to draw a butterfly population because they are isolated. Wooded, brushy sites without sun don’t attract the butterflies. You may see them around but they’re not living on this population of the plant..

Mrs. Lechmanski: Who monitors your study?

Mr. Nicholson: The US Dept. of Fish and Wildlife.

Mrs. Lechmanski: And they just accept it?

Mr. Nicholson: They do when it’s done during the established flight times

Mr. Patricke: I just want to answer the question about the wells across the street. The problem was that the sites higher up the mountain on the slope had to dynamite to get 700 feet deep wells, and that held up building on the lower sites. But there is no problem now and it is not related to there being water in the aquifer.

Mr. Nicholson: And the Dept. of Health will not approve them if there is any problem with the water. Wells drilled in that area are yielding 25-30 gallons a minute, which is more than enough.

Tom Georgiana: I still have concerns about all these.

Mr. Geary: Our wells are a lot more that 50 feet deep they are 140 feet deep. We have all talked and they are deeper than that. They do draw plenty.

Mr. Georgiana: I do think that water will be a problem. Also I am concerned is this a PUD? I had to build on a three acre lot 19 years ago. Why do we have to have all these tiny lots and put huge houses on them? People want to come live here because it’s rural, so let’s keep it that way. How much money do people have to have? Other towns are already clustered and trying to get their rural space back.

Mrs. Lechmanski: Quality of life is a concern. 49 building lots at Palmerton heights 26 here, and as many at DA Collins. Another 100 homes on the road – secondary to the congestion, all the reasons we love it there are going to disappear.

Mr. Tim Kays: The traffic numbers?

Mr. Nicholson: 23 trips in am and pm peak hours going out and 8 trips entering. That’s over the two hour time span of peak travel.

Mr. Kays: What about deliveries and services and other trips? You’re saying there will be nothing like that. There’s really 200 more cars all day long.

Mr. Nicholson: There is methodology by which the traffic is analyzed in the engineering community.

Mrs. Kays: That access road is in a dangerous, unsafe area. That’s a blind corner coming down a hill.

Mr. Field: Sight distances are adequate, right?

Mr. Nicholson: Yes, by national standards. Traffic safety recommended putting the access road in that area.

Ted Been: That entrance is going to be a two lane boulevard? What time of year was that sight line done? Right now there is not much sight, cars tend to go fast through there and it can be tough to get out of our property across the street. You have to take into account foliage in the line of sight.

Mr. Nicholson: The horizontal and vertical line of sight and sight distance are all considered for all seasons.

Chuck Rosen: I have lived in the city all my life and I am not used to this water issue; Worst case scenario- what happens if we did run out of water?

Chairman Jensen: You would probably appeal to the Town Board.

Tim Catillays:. I live to the West of the entrance road. Could you explain where is pole that is added is going to go?

Mr. Nicholson: There will be underground power throughout the subdivision. The new pole somewhere in there—the opposite side of the Boulevard from your property.

Mr. Catillays: That retention area- where will the overflow run?

Mr. Nicholson: There is no overflow, we expect 100% recharge because of the sand conditions. This area is only handling a small percentage of the runoff.

Mr. Catillays: I have seen ponding water right where your entrance area is during spring thaw. There is a pipe crossing Old Saratoga Road, and I’ve never seen water in it. In freezing conditions, water can’t dissipate. Your roadway might get flooded.

Mr. Nicholson: We are not altering any grading within 20-30 feet of your property and not changing the drainage on the property line. The road will be depressed so that it goes into the basin.

Mr. Catillays: What about runoff from my property?

Mr. Nicholson: It will handle whatever runoff is already generated as well as that which is added. If water ponds here now, it won’t after.

Mr. Catillays: But can the retention pond handle that?

Mr. Nicholson: We believe so, this study was handled as well as any other and they always consider the entire area. Most of it discharges into the pond.

Mr. Patricke: Please note that they review that specifically with Tim Burley, Town Engineer.

Mr. Catillays: There is a piece of property that will be owned and maintained by the associations?

Mr. Nicholson: Owned by the general HOA for the property which is responsible to maintain 14.5 acres of open common space, including the entrance and landscape signs. Jerry, could you elaborate on what type of maintenance will be done?

Mr. Magoolaghan: What are your questions?

Mr. Catillays: What will they do? Any clearing? Who handles it if we don’t like what they’re doing?

Mr. Patricke: The Town Board would not address it. The HOA owns the land. They can do what they want with it.

Mr. Catillays: Could Mr. Blemonte’s representative tell us what he wants to do?

Mr. Magooglaghan: No clearing. Seeded along the road but not cleared. A lawn service will handle mowing. The roads will be city streets, plowed by the town. The shared driveway is a private road and that driveway will be cleared by the property owners.

Mr. Catillays: The lot South of mine, when I reviewed the plans, setback restrictions are shown. Is there are requirement that the septic and disposal fall behind setbacks as well?

Mr. Patricke: Septic is10 feet, well 15 feet, set by the Health Department. Structures 20 feet, set by the Zoning Department.

Mr. Catillays: What are the guidelines for a septic systems to be close to my well?

Mr. Patricke: Their septic has to be 100 feet from your well, spotted by a professional engineer.

Mr. Catillays: I anticipate that they will have trouble keeping their well 100 feet from their septic as well as from my septic. No one has come to my house to ask where those things are located.

Mr. Patricke: There will be a minimum, and it could be more than what I told you if there is a steep grade.

Mr. Catillays: One more question on those 5 lots on the main road- why put those out there as flag lots?

Mr. Nicholson: They needed legal frontage on a public road, and this allows that as well as a common driveway, which is preferred. It is like a private town road, maintained by those 5-6 homeowners.

Mr. Deuval: I own all the property on the left of that diagram down to Ashford Estates. They are tight to my border. What if I decide to develop my property? We will be too tight and I can’t decide to do the same thing someday. The way everything is laid out here, it is to Mr. Garcia’s advantage and I can’t develop my property the same way. I had to have 4 acres when I built my property and this is going to devalue my property down the road. Furthermore when DA Collins decided to use the sand pit, everyone complained about the trucks being used. If you close Mountain Road, there will be no fire access and we lose everything. We are choked off. You have to look abroad. Mr. Garcia can develop, but he’s being greedy and affecting my property.

Mr. Been: I want to go back to the Boulevard and the drainage issue. I didn’t even know there was a culvert there and now there’s going to be reverse flow?

Mr. Nicholson: There will be no reverse flow.

Mr. Been: Have lights been discussed at the intersection or on the boulevard? I think they are an annoyance to people who want to preserve the rural area. Is that something we can address now? I know the town is on a lighting district kick.

Mr. Patricke: The Town Board has directed us to put street lighting in all subdivisions.

Mr. Been: What are the standards?

Mr. Patricke: We use a 100 watt high pressure sodium bulb on intersections and curves.

Mr. Been: So one on the front and one where the road breaks?

Mr. Nicholson: Here, here and here.

Mr. Patricke: Where the private road and the cul de sacs come out.

Mr. Nicholson(Points out 7)

Mrs. Lechmanski: What is the necessity for the boulevard? It’s out of character. Could you lessen the impact by making it a single lane?

Mr. Patricke: The developer would love that but it has to be a boulevard per town requirements when there is only one point of entrance, the second lane as an alternate means of access.

Mr. Been: How long is the municipal portion of this road?

Mr. Nicholson: 2100 feet

Mr. Been: What are the town regs regarding that? I thought it was 1200 feet on a single egress.

Mr. Nicholson: Single egress starts from where the last driveway comes out.

Mr. Been: So the purpose of the boulevard is that the town requires it. How long is it from the boulevard to the cul de sac?

Mr. Magooglaghan: The single egress starts at the jug handle. Because emergency vehicles can go around through there.

Mr. Been: Why the shared driveways then? What precedents are we setting accepting private roads?

Mr. Patricke: With a cluster subdivision, they establish density in one manner and then they can accomplish it however they want to. They could add another road and have as many lots. This seemed like a reasonable alternative with guidance from the planning circles.

Mr. Field We have discouraged them up until now, but we were the last to do so. We had the highway and fire departments in on this design and handled their concerns. Before, everyone who wanted a private road wanted to make it so small that the emergency services would not have access.

Mrs. Kropp: I digress, but I do agree with Mrs. that on a visual thing, this boulevard – Old Saratoga Road is only a two lane road and we have emergency services without a boulevard.

Mr. Field: It’s because there is only one entrance.

Mrs. Kropp: I do not see power lines at Palmerton. I would really like to see power and that buried. Can the town get National Grid to bury that stuff?

Chairman Jensen: From personal experience, Grid just says No.

Mrs. Kropp: Now that Poletti is going in, we could eliminate some of that with all of these developers.

Chairman Jensen: Bug National Grid.

Mr. Catillays: The association entranceway between my property and theirs. Is there a requirement that part if that parcel be cleared for sight distance?

Mr. Nicholson: Off the top of my head, no. Id have to look at the study.

Mr. Catillays: There are beautiful trees there.

Mr. Patricke: The highway dept has been trimming trees.

Mr. Georgianna : Structure heights?

Chairman Jensen: They have to meet town requirements. We have no architectural review in town, just NYS building codes.

Mr. Francis: How many houses are on that map?

Mr. Nicholson: 26.

Mr. Francis: Average acreage?

Mr. Nicholson: Some are a little over an acre, 1.75, 2 acres.

Mr. Francis: What does it take to have 200 foot frontage on the land or a minimum lot size?

Mr. Patricke: They are allowed to cluster the subdivision by the town codes. In order to promote green space and limit road frontage, the Planning Board allows them to reduce the required frontage within reason.

Mr. Francis: Related to zoning as well?

Chairman Jensen: Zoning laws vary based on district.

Mr. Francis: We are looking at a lot of change if everyone develops his own land. There is nothing to do because it has been approved.

Chairman Jensen: Not yet.

Mr. Francis: So do you consider this impact on the face of the area and not just the regulations complied to on this map? It’s a philosophical thing. We could integrate a smaller number of houses into the landscape.

Mr. Field: The subdivision regulations are set in a political process, and we have a comprehensive committee trying to set a new set of philosophies for the town. We are given codes to adhere to, and the last time this occurred here was 1990. Clustering was introduced and was considered appropriate in all districts. So we are stuck with the concept. We can work within it, but if it looks appropriate, it can happen. It’s the nature of the process.

Mr. Magooglaghan: You make a good point, but let me explain that this property is actually zoned for 34 houses. The Garcias are giving up a greater amount of profit by having fewer houses, a minimum property size, restricted clearing. They are doing less that they might have because they do care, and you should take that into consideration.

Mr. Francis: I am very new in the area. I don’t want to have a bad relationship with the Garcia’s. I just want to have a buff around this project to limit the impact. I want them to think about the needs of the people around them.

Mr. Geary: On the bottom of the cul de sac there’s no house.

Mr. Nicholson: That’s a storm water management lot.

Mr. Geary: It’s a swamp in my back yard with mosquitoes.

Mr. Nicholson: We expect the soil to recharge there will be no standing water, as proven by our soil borings above the water table.

Mr. Geary: OK, you said there was going to be a wooded area. How can you do that and put in a septic and well without clearing? There’s too many houses and they are too close together. I pay taxes and I have a beautiful view of the mountain. Here’s a picture of my back yard, and you’re going to put 4 houses on that? I pay $6500 in taxes every year? And when is this process over?

Chairman Jensen: We have this hearing, then we do SEQR Review, prelim approval, when the applicant is ready it goes to the Department of Health, and if it all passes it comes back here for final review. It could be months.

Mrs. Lechmanski: Will we be notified of changes?

Mr. Patricke: If there are material changes.

Mr. Geary: We will not hear anything else?

Mr. Patricke: You can always come back if they are on the agenda, and you can call tow town and find out whether they will be. They could have prelim approval tonight and be back in a month.

Mrs. Kropp: Could you describe your buffers? Can future owners cut down etc., so they can have grass right up to the setback?

Mr. Nicholson: There are building line setbacks for houses and accessory buildings. There are no requirements for a no-clear buffer. And there’s no proposal for one either.

Mrs. Kropp: We thought we heard that there would be areas where future owners could not cut.

Mr. Magooglaghan: The best buffer is the natural buffer that we intend to maintain. A fence or bushes would require that we cut. With the HOA the lots are deed restricted.

Mr. Francis: So there is no buffer, just a property line. We will not build fences but we would like a buffer in the area.

Mrs. Kays. Isn’t it the towns and the planning board’s responsibility to keep area natural to the surroundings? This is not natural to the existing area. Not only is it a cluster they are less than 3 acre lots and they are on private roads.

Chairman Jensen: Is your house natural to the area?

Mrs. Kays: It is.

Chairman Jensen: This applicant can do what he wants with is property within the town codes. Our code allows you to do whatever it allows, and this board can’t usurp the code.

Mrs. Kays: You have that power but you also have the power to control the environment when developers come in and ask for all these additional things. Doesn’t it matter what the people want in the area?

Mr. Deuval: I own the land on the far left. It used to be a horse farm. We have a few posts with barbed wire. That’s my property line. It’s grandfathered in as agricultural. It’s primitive, but it’s all still there. We can’t stop this, but it’s too much. It doesn’t need to be that much. We have two more developments that are coming in. Can’t you minimize it? Can we get a copy of this?

Chairman Jensen: You can review a copy of it during normal business hours. You can get a copy if you pay for it. It is all public.

Mr. Patricke: We have no way to copy the plans, they are sent out. But you can get it.

Mr. Field: These various reports are all part of the public record as well, right? Some of those have the subdivision maps on a smaller scale.

Mr. Georgiana: I just want you guys to look at the whole project with the other developments in the area and the water issue, the rural environment and the park down there.

Mr. Dixon: And all the other land down there to be developed.

Mr. Been: There are 26 more people to come to these meetings with you to fight development after they move into all these houses.

Mr. Catillays: You should think of the best interest of everyone in the area not just the developers.

Mr. Dixon: We have a set of rules to go by and we can’t refuse them if they are legal.

Mr. Catillays: Then why are we here?

Mr. Patricke: The Town Board is the place you want to go if you want to change the zoning and the comprehensive plan that established the cluster zoning.

Chairman Jensen: We receive our directions from codes adopted and can only be changed by the Town Board. It has not been revised since 1989.

Mr. Field: The R-4 district was requested by the residents of Old Saratoga Road.

Mr. Georgianna: So if they follow the rules and they are legal, you have to let it go through? So we have to find an angle to make it not legal. Butterflies or arrows or something.

Lena Geary, Ashford Estates: I know the town just increased the height. Do you know if these homes will be 38 feet?

Mr. Magooglaghan: The homes are not designed yet. But it measurement is from the lowest point to the highest point. We will likely be in the 30’s, but 38 feet is an unusually large house.

Mrs. Geary: Your vote is going to crush my personal American dream. A developer told us that this property would never be developed because of the slope of the land and because the Garcia’s would never sell.

Chairman Jensen: Any other questions at this time?

Mr. Been: One last question. Will deed restrictions you talked about be put in the approval so that they don’t just go out the window?

Mr. Magooglaghan: We have submitted the general outline of the HOA guidelines, They have to be approved by the state of NY attorney general. We have a number of these projects and they are pretty good guidelines.

Mr. Been: But since he’s offering to do that, can we incorporate those buffer zones and guarantee that they are in the approval?

Mr. Patricke: There’s no town enforcement of those deed restrictions.

Mr. Been: Since he’s offering it why can’t we record it?

Mr. Patricke: He’s putting it in the HOA, but we are not going to enforce it. I think the town attorney will tell you no.

Mr. Been: I think the residents would be happy with 30 foot buffer in there. I’m bring it up because Mr. Nicholson brought it up. The HOA is all well and good, but how do we know what will be in it? He made that offer and we want it guaranteed.

Mr. Patricke: That’s a civil dispute. Those are private homeowners and the HOA has nothing to do with them.

Mr. Been: So why can’t the plans show it?

Mr. Patricke: Because we can’t pick on those people to use their property a certain way when you can do what you want with yours.

Mrs. Kays: It’s about the natural environment

Mrs. Kropp: Even though the HOA is done by the Attorney General, can’t the Homeowners change it later if they want to anyway? I’ve done that with 2/3 of the people in our association. So it’s a moot point to discuss what the HOA says.

Mr. Been: What about a deed restriction?

Mr. Patricke: He’s willing to put those in, but there’s no protection from that unless you take them to court. Jerry do you have deed restrictions written up?

Mr. Magooglaghan: There will be.

Mr. Geary: I understand if I own some house in there I don’t want the town in there telling me what to do. Couldn’t you alter the plan so that the outside border was also part of the HOA and was forever wild for 30-40 feet?

Mr. Georgianna: How much will the houses be priced, range?

Mr. Magooglaghan: Right now we build $300,000 houses.

Mr. Georgianna: Nine million. How much do the Garcia’s need?

Chairman Jensen: This process is not over. I am going to ask for a motion to table, which means that we will revisit this question again next month. I did hear a concern that I am going to ask Gordon to address, as part of the EAF, I heard tonight about this snake, and I want that addressed before we delve into the EAF. We do listen to what goes on here even if we can’t change it.

Mr. Magooglaghan: That is addressed in a report before the Board. It is on the list as a species of interest, not endangered in New York State.

Mr. Geary: Check the MIT website.

Mr. Georgianna: Does this go before the Town Board now?

Chairman Jensen: No. Just us. Come next month. Motion to table the public hearing? Before you table, anything from the applicant?

Mr. Magooglaghan: We have reports that indicate there are no endangered species. Why are we tabling the hearing? This man is not a scientist.

Mr. Patricke: Do have Travis Mitchell check.

Mr. Dickinson: Motion to table the public hearing on The Preserve at Old Saratoga

Mr. Zimmerman: Second.

All in favor.

Chairman Jensen: Before we adjourn, Gordon do you have anything else to being up?

Mr. Nicholson: Not at this point. I will look into the storm for the adjacent area and maybe a report in the underlying aquifer.

Chairman Jensen: The water came up several times in Palmerton and Poletti and the Health Department was quite content with the water.

Mr. Nicholson: I talked with the people who did the water across the street, and they said the same thing.

Mr. Garcia: I want to reaffirm about the 30 foot buffer. I was amazed last year when I found out that they had gone out and clear cut up from the other end of the property.

Mr. Field: People always want the other person’s land to have the buffer on it.

Chairman Jensen: Let’s review the minutes of the May 15^th 2006 meeting…Any additions or corrections?

Mr. Dixon: Motion to approve the minutes of the May 15, 2006 meeting.

Mr. Zimmerman: Second

All in favor with Mr. Field and Mr. Caulin abstaining.

Chairman Jensen: June minutes, any additions or corrections?

Mr. Dixon: Motion to approve.

Mr. Zimmerman: Second,

All in favor abstentions

Chairman Jensen: July 17, 2006 minutes, any additions or corrections?

Mr. Dixon: Motion to approve.

Mr. Field: Second.

All in favor with Mr. Zimmerman abstaining.

Chairman Jensen: Minutes of August 21 2006 meeting, and additions or corrections

Mr. Caulin: On page 897-Abilene not Abling.

Mr. Dixon: Motion to approve as amended.

Mr. Caulin: Second

All in favor with Mr. Dickinson and Mr. Field abstaining.

Chairman Jensen: For Cerrone Subdivision, now known as Pinewood Estates, I did not ask for a motion for a chair and one other member to sin the mylars as soon as they were completed. I did not ask for a reason, because during discussion there was a indication that there would be a change to indicate the addition of signage that I did not want to sign without the Board’s approval. Nothing has further been submitted from that project.

Cerrone Builders, Woodscape, Leonelli Apartments, The Garcias and Westgate will likely all be present for the Oct 16 meeting. Board, should Mr. Patricke receive further applications, do you want to choose a second meeting date, or advise Mr. Patricke that your agenda is full?

Mr. Dixon: I would choose to do two meetings.

Mr. Patricke: I would say close your agenda because some of those may be quick.

Mr. Dixon motioned to adjourn the meeting at 10:13p.m. and Mr. Zimmerman seconded.

The motion passed unanimously. Next meeting October 16, 2006.

Respectfully submitted,

Tricia Andrews

Recording Secretary

Cc: Zoning Board, Town Board, Town Clerk, Supt. of Highways, Building Inspector, Assessor, Saratoga County Planning Board